Is Pride Toronto's city funding on the chopping block?
TORONTO NEWS / Rae attends meeting at mayor's office day before council resumes
James Burrell / Toronto / Wednesday, March 31, 2010
Share |

UPDATE April 1, 2pm: Funding for Pride Toronto did not appear on today's or yesterday's city council agenda. Meanwhile, councillor Kyle Rae says he's not pressuring the city to restrict Pride Toronto's funding (see comment exchange, below) and instead is trying to make sure it remains in place.

A meeting was called at City Hall on March 30 to discuss Pride Toronto, according to Stuart Green, the mayor's deputy director of communications.

Details of the meeting, held at the office of mayor David Miller, are not known, but the briefing was attended by city councillor Kyle Rae and the city's executive director of culture, Rita Davies.

Attempts to reach Pride Toronto to confirm its involvement — or lack of — at the briefing were unsuccessful. Requests for interviews with Rae and Davies were also unanswered by time of writing.

In an email obtained by Xtra dated March 29, Rae threatened that the City of Toronto could take action against Pride Toronto for failing to oust Queers Against Israeli Apartheid (QuAIA) in advance of the parade.

"The City of Toronto must ascertain if the city's policies concerning anti-discrimination are compromised by QuAIA's rhetoric and messaging," Rae wrote.

In 2009, Pride Toronto received close to $175,000 in support from the City of Toronto, through three separate programs. In 2008, it received $189,000.

City council's next meeting is scheduled for March 31, with another for April 1 — in which the topic of Pride Toronto funding is expected to come up. Additionally, budget meetings set for April 15 and 16 could further address funding for the event.

On March 10, Pride Toronto announced that participants would be required to vet signage with an ethics committee prior to the parade. That announcement sparked outrage in the queer community and was retracted two weeks later.

A Facebook site, Don't Sanitize Pride (which attracted more than 1600 members), applauded the move, while a March 24 Toronto Sun article questioned whether city grants recipients (like Pride Toronto) should be "held accountable" for the funds they receive. That prompted speculation about a review of this year's event funding, worth roughly $120,000 a year to Pride Toronto.
Follow the city council meeting online here.

[Landing photo courtesy of Toronto.ca]


Share |


Reader Comments


 
Thanks Kyle!
I guess the opinion of the community matters less than our outgoing councillor. If he was running for re-election there's no way he would try to pull a stunt like threaten Pride funding. Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out Kyle!
Her Royal Majesty, Toronto ON
03/31/10 8:55 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
what?
How does criticism of a state entity count as violating anti-discrimination laws? Is it okay to criticize Japan for whaling laws or Uganda for anti-queer legislation but not okay to criticize Israel for military occupation and discriminatory laws?
Sav, Toronto ON
03/31/10 10:09 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Puff
Don't forget threats to have to pay the costs for policing and clean up and threats of cancelling the parade because of safety!
Really, Toronto ON
03/31/10 11:21 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
its nonsense
In Rae's letter he affirmed there's nothing wrong with being critical of Israeli policy, he just questioned whether such discourse belongs at Pride. That's a long way from comprimising the city's anti-discrimination policy. I would agree if it were a QuAIA parade but its not, its a Pride parade and there will be a wide variety of views and beliefs on display, QuAIA's being just one of them. The pro-Israeli, pro-occupation side will be there just the same as last year. If the city starts cherry picking who should be allowed in the parade where does it stop? Some feel the presence of TNTMEN is unwelcoming too, what about the large corporate presence, I find them unwelcoming and I know many others do too. The parade can't be all things to all people, much better than deciding who has a right to be heard or not is allow everyone's voice. With all the uproar by the right wing over attacks on free speech lately you'd think they'd be flocking to the cause of QuAIA but of course they only support free speech for those they agree with, we must do much better and protect it for all no matter what we may think of their message, if the gay community and specifically Pride isn't capable of doing this then who in our society could be?
Rich, Toronto Ontario
03/31/10 2:38 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Pride funding
In typical Xtra fashion, it is erroneously being reported that I am threatening to jeopardize City funding for Pride Toronto. This is not the case. In fact, I am trying to preserve funding for the event and not let the current debate over QuAIA spoil 30 years of triumph, growth and celebration. Xtraā€™s reporting couldnā€™t be further from the truth, which why I hesitate to answer calls from their reporters. Kyle Rae City Councillor
Kyle Rae, City Councillor, Toronto ON
03/31/10 6:30 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Puff
So can we take it from this post that you, Kyle Rae, as Chair of the Economic Development Committee will move to fully fund Pride financially and inkind funding this year? Without insisting that Pride "police the parade" with bogus censorship policies and leave the hate crimes to the police.
Really, Toronto ON
03/31/10 7:26 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Dear Kyle
Let me wrap my head around this. You wrote: "Xtra's reporting couldn't be further from the truth, which [is] why I hesitate to answer calls from their reporters." Wouldn't it be better to answer their calls so you can ensure that the record is accurate?!
Rick, London Ontario
03/31/10 7:42 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Ed's note
This might be a good time to outline how Xtra reporters and editors worked to ensure the sources and subjects in this story got every opportunity to clear the record. We called Rae's office several times since the Sun story appeared. Our reporter visited City Hall in person. We even forwarded the letter and email at the center of Xtra's story to Rae prior to publication. We wanted to ensure that he knew what we were about to publish, so that he had every opportunity to respond, to clear the record and to share his position. Rae is not, incidentally, The City of Toronto, as he seems to believe if you compare his above post with our story. It seems a bit like an MP refering to him- or herself as Canada. As for the cheap jab at Xtra, in typical Rae fashion, he is once again attempting to stonewall an unfolding story by casting aspersions on anyone who dares to ask meaningful or challening questions of him. Let's do an interview Kyle, just you and me. Phone or in person. Tomorrow. Just say when. We'll podcast it in its entirety on this site and people can make up their own minds.
Matt Mills, Toronto Ont
03/31/10 8:52 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Pro Occupation?
I didn't see any pro occupation signs in the parade. I did see signs celebrating gay rights in Israel.
Peter, Hamilton ON
04/01/10 3:49 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Also, dear Kyle,
If you are "trying to preserve funding for the event and not let the current debate over QuAIA spoil 30 years of triumph, growth and celebration," you might do so by reinforcing to the City of Toronto funders that political organizations and political content have always been a part of the Pride parade (including groups and signs critical of human rights concerns in other countries). We rightly complain about sponsors who give money to events like Pride and then try to control the message. Why does the City of Toronto feel that they should be able to do the same?
David Demchuk, Toronto Ontario
04/01/10 4:17 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Don't rush to judgment
I think it's important that everyone take a step back and not rush to judgment regarding Councilman Rae's actions. I think you need to check out what exactly took place last year at the pride parade to understand why QuAIA's actions promote hatred. I recommend you check out www.reclaimingourpride.ca
Daniel Engel, Toronto Ontario
04/01/10 5:21 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Israel's propaganda & Gladstone's lies
PETER: Israel has extended gay rights selectively -- and then uses those limited rights to promote itself as a bastion of liberal democracy. It's BS. Not all LGBT people within the boundaries controlled by Israel enjoy equality rights. | DANIEL: I see you've provided a link to Martin Gladstone's homemade propaganda video. We all know that Gladstone tried to stack Pride Toronto's focus groups; so, why should we trust this piece of crap? Are you prepared to accept responsibility for the lies and defamation it contains? And why not provide the other side of the story? SEE: http://queersagainstapartheid.org/2010/03/31/martin-gladstones-campaign-of-lies-and-defamation/ -- AND ALSO SEE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNV6QkRtj3A | These human rights advocates -- members of our LGBT community -- sure don't seem like hate-campaigners to me! Time to stop the smears. The Israel Lobby is out of control; ALSO SEE: http://www.cautbulletin.ca/en_article.asp?articleid=2908
Rick, London Ontario
04/01/10 5:59 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Easy there
Well obviously Rick, I disagree with your comments. But I don't see a point in arguing with you about it over an Xtra message board. I posted the link because councilman Rae has seen the film and it has persuasive value. I simply would like to encourage everyone to see the film and make up their own minds as to whether or not QuAIA is promoting hatred.
Daniel, Toronto Ontario
04/01/10 8:21 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
BAN QuAIA
Thank you to Daniel for posting the online video through the website provided. I am shocked to learn that QuAIA is actually promoting hatred in the Parade and I want the group to be banned from the Parade because it is a hate crime! The video has convinced me already and sorry, QuAIA- please don't come to Pride Parade in Toronto- it is too scary already! Geez, let's ban QuAIA, and I am sure everyone will agree with this!
Shocked Guy, Toronto Ontario
04/01/10 8:28 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
TAKE BACK OUR PRIDE
BAN THE QuAIA they are not a gay rights group and they openly support the oppressors of Gay Palestinians and are just another Anti- Israel groups and they are people who use personal insults when others don't agree which neither has no place in Pride and as South African who did live under Apartheid this is rather insulting since they are spreading lies and hate toward Jewish People and even Gay Palestinians and hate also has no place in Pride. If they want to protest the actions if Israel and the false Apartheid allegory then they can go to Gaza or the West Bank or on Labor Day since they get direct funding from CUPE Ontario. Pride is a day that everyone should enjoy and not be hijacked from radical leftest on other political non gay rights causes and what next they are going to let the KKK march or Neo Nazis?? they also oppose Zionism this it what it will lead too. TAKE BACK OUR PRIDE
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/01/10 10:19 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
War Zone
Israel is at war with it's neighbours. It's neighbours are at war with Israel. Same as the most of the posted comments here. Each trying out do the other's sound bytes. Meaning Communication Stops when we are at war with each other! Let us start real dialogue by giving something up or compromising a little, only that way, can the two sides come to a peaceful solution between Pride Toronto and the various interest/lobby groups. Nothing is accomplished in a screaming match.
Michel F. Paré, Toronto ON
04/02/10 1:33 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
When is Hamas Promotes Hate and Terror Week ?
Hey people, haven't you realized it yet? The people running QuAIA are professional political militants who are totally manipulating the lot of you into fighting for what are in fact a series of half truths, innuendo and outright lies. More to the point: They already have 364 days of the year to mouth off against Israel. WHY DO THEY NEED TO USURP PRIDE DAY AND APPROPRIATE its SPECIFICALLY Gay content for something that has nothing to do with being gay at all... except that they are supporting the homophobic side which, if it wins, will destroy the ONE state in the Middle East which has a certain respect for gays and upholds their rights? They say they aren't anti-Semitic, but has anyone EVER heard them make a SINGLE criticism of anything coming from the Palestinian side? When, in its Charter, Hamas says they want to kill not just Israelis but Jews ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD - why do the members of QuAIA remain totally uncritical and silent? That sounds pretty anti-Semitic to me...to chose only Jews to excoriate and give the Palestinians a free pass to do any and everything with NO criticism at all. Tell that to the Thai person who was killed by an illegal rocket shot into Israel last week. Hypocritical and biased...but SO PC...they SHOULD be banned from Pride. Who needs dissension in the ranks for a group which isn't even protesting something germane to gays topics...
Ken, Paris France
04/03/10 9:37 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Illegal occupation & separation wall-fence
According to the United Nations, Israel is engaged in an illegal occupation. According to Jewish Israeli scholar Prof. Dr. Ilan Pappe, Israel's creation was preceded by an ethnic cleansing of Palestine. Ehud Barak (Israel's Minister of Defence), Michael Ignatieff, Naomi Klein, Jimmy Carter, Desmond Tutu -- the list goes on -- have described apartheid in Israel. "Apartheid" is clearly defined by the International Criminal Court. To support Palestinian liberation is NOT to support Hamas; in fact, supporting Hamas only hurts the Palestinian people. (QuAIA does not support Hamas.) Using LGBT equality rights as an example, Israel promotes itself as bastion of liberal democracy; it is a lie. Israel does NOT provide equality rights to all LGBT people within the boundaries it controls. Furthermore, Israel is hardly a homophobia-free society; Orthodox Jews have been responsible for recent anti-gay murders. LGBT people living under apartheid struggle immensely; winning rights and liberty requires better social conditions, and such social conditions are rendered impossible by Israel's domination and starvation of Palestinian people. Israeli apartheid IS a LGBT issue. QUESTION: RATHER THAN FLING SHIT AND LIES, WHY DON'T THE ZIONISTS AND PRO-APARTHEID MOUTHPIECES JUST ADDRESS THESE ARGUMENTS WITH LOGIC AND EVIDENCE? Answer: Because truth is not on their side. You want the whole truth? Listen to Dr. Norman Finkelstein -- a Jewish scholar whose parents are both Holocaust survivors: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MON2HL02mec
Rick, London Ontario
04/04/10 12:53 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
So What your point Rick ?????
@ Rick What's your point?? Canada is still rather homophobic and is still considered a big problem in Canada too and this is really well documented in many if not all Human Rights Reports issue by the Government each year maybe you should read on Apartheid, the South Africans got the idea from Canada's native reverse system????? sounds familiar? and again I fail to see how this is a Gay Rights Issue when Israel does recognize same sex unions,gives Gays equal rights, allows Gay Palestinians to live in Israel,and has Openly Gay members of the Knesset and there many Arab members ones too. And what's yours point on Dr. Norman Finkelstein or Dr. Ilan Pappe both have been discredited by most in Academia community and please read book review many of these can be found on JSTOR I think you might have access to this for some reason. This is the part I found most interesting you said and quoting Orthodox Jews have been responsible for recent anti-gay murders wow ALL attacks including the Tel Aviv Club and was Condemn by Israeli Society including the Current Prime Minister and the President and all the Political Parties including all political parties and but please tell me this the next time when a Christian Fundamentalists in the US attack Gay night clubs in the Atlanta area such as in 1997 or when a US military blames gays or the Srebrenica massacre for example and see how many American officials Condemn them??? . The Problem is that the QuAIA is clearly not a Gay Rights group, oddly Israel does have a rather large Gay community and in Israel homosexuality is Legal under Israeli Law as it is under Canadian Law and yes in Both countries homophobia is a problem.
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/04/10 2:26 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@ Rick
and oddly the QuAIA is not a gay rights group when it thinks that the only country in the Middle East were LGBT people enjoy equal rights and are free to be LGBT and the rights are protected by the government and attacks on LGBT are widely condemn by society are anti- gay parts because of a few bad apples and these attacks do happen in Canada and are usually founded in many year reports by RCMP or even Human Rights Reports issued by the Canadian Government EVERY YEAR there is always something about the about homophobia. In the Islamic world and in Palestinian Society being LGBT is illegal and the punishment is death and you also said WHY DON'T THE ZIONISTS AND PRO-APARTHEID MOUTHPIECES JUST ADDRESS THESE ARGUMENTS WITH LOGIC AND EVIDENCE? oddly I have many many many many many many many times and if your going to retort to personal attacks which many members of the QuAIA have done on the Xrta forum do they only due this when they are proven wrong and most of the post by QuAIA members are usually this and also Rick as a South African who did live under real Apartheid and experienced it. Since you brought up Dr. Ilan Pappe who is a Israeli Citizen if this was South Africa under Apartheid he would be considered a Banned Person for criticizing the government and that person would have severe restrictions on their movement or be banned form political activities,arrested, tortured,could not leave the country, or even be in Academia and Israel has no such law in place and many Israeli's do openly criticize the Israeli government so does many in the Israeli media and in South Africa if the press did that the editors of any media outlet would be considered a Banned Person during Apartheid, and many Israeli's including the creator of movie the Bubble, Eyton Fox does this and that movie which it is a gay themed movie did get money form the Israeli government for example. From that it truly you don't understand what Apartheid is.
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/04/10 2:56 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@ Rick
and oddly Rick giving examples such as Dr. Ilan Pappe who is a Israeli citizen gives more proof that Israel is a Liberal Democracy and also Rick the QuAIA seems to not understand Orthodox Judaism its usually Orthodox Jews are the ones that are Anti-Zionist they are also sometimes known as the Nerurai Karta and seems the QuAIA does not mind bashing Orthodox Jews which is a form of discrimination and is a form Antisemitism and also there are many people in the LGBT community who would consider themselves to be Orthodox Jews and this is clearly alienated them from Pride or the LGBT community by using that example does show the hate and how intolerance the QuAIA has towards Jews, even Orthodox Jews in the LGBT community and this does not belong in PRIDE or even in the LGBT community and proves that it NOT a Gay Rights group since its clearly the QuAIA does discriminate against in the LGBT community Just a thought and gives another reason that the QuAIA is more like the KKK or even Neo Nazi groups when using such an example and if anyone from PRIDE is reading this or even officials from Toronto City Council is read this then they should take this into consideration when allowing QuAIA at Pride if they are going to allow people to march that discriminates Orthodox Jews who are also members of the LGBT or members or any organize religion and many are members of the LGBT community. The QuAIA do discriminate openly against these people and other members of the LGBT community and toleration is something that is apart of our community and is something the QuAIA does not understand and bashing Orthodox Jews is a really good example of this.
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/04/10 3:41 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@Rick
many of us in the LGBT community are members of a organize religion and do consider themselves Jewish, Christian, Muslim,etc... When a so called Gay Rights Group bashes people based on religion such as the QuAIA did openly bash Orthodox Jews and other religions as well kind of shows how this group has nothing to do with Gay Rights and I believe any LGBT person would understand that religion is apart us as well as being LGBT and sometimes many of us turn to the LGBT community for Support in matters such as this and I think any LGBT person does know what I'm talking about. But Sicne the QuAIA does not like Orthodox Jews who are members of the LGBT community who are members kind of gives a reason why QuAIA are not a Gay Rights group but a group that openly discriminates against others in the LGBT community because they might be Orthodox Jews for example gives another reason that the QuAIA sounds a lot like the KKK and another reason why it does not belong in OUR Pride because discrimination is NOT APART OF OUR COMMUNITY AND IF ANYONE FROM PRIDE IS READING Rick's comments who is clearly a member of the QuAIA shows this Clearly and also that they don't care about Gay Rights but is rather a hate group since they are discriminate against members of our Community such as Orthodox Jews, Christians or Muslims who look to the LGBT community support. Pride or the City of Toronto SHOULD TAKE THEIR RELIGIOUS HATRED INTO CONSIDERATION and this also proves that the QuAIA is not a gay rights groups when they bash the religious beliefs people even those in the LGBT community.
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/04/10 4:13 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@ Rick
and discriminating anyone base of Religion or even nationality since the QuAIA does discriminate against Orthodox Jews and Israelis is a violation of Canadian Law and is considered a hate crime under Canadian Law and the QuAIA because of that shows how they are not a gay rights group but rather a group that does openly discriminate against anyone and members of the LGBT community base of Religion or even nationality which in this case I think the QuAIA becasue of this needs a taste of reality such as the Law and no one is above Canadian Hate Crime Laws even if they claim to be a gay rights group which it clearly not
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/04/10 4:30 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
BAN QuAIA NOW!
Hey, I watched the online video and the evidence has been proven that QuAIA is actually promoting HATE. What are these hidden agendas that QuAIA is hiding from? QuAIA is here to destroy our LGBTTIQQ2SA community and taken away our Pride celebration in this community. Let's ban QuAIA from joining the Parade because this is not a place for them to promote hate against other queer community! Who agrees?
Shocked Guy, Toronto Ontario
04/06/10 2:18 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Ban QuAIA from Pride
The part how they seem to be blaming Jews like Rick is doing on this forum. Its clear to me that the QuAIA is not a Gay rights group but rather a Anti- Israel group using Gay Rights as a cover and Rick, I am Gay Orthodox Jew and blaming us proves the Anti Semitic nature of this group you seem not to be blaming a country but a group of people and I hoping Pride and the City of Toronto realize this mistake and because of this group I will not be attending Pride since its clear they want to alienate Orthodox Jew members of Gay community and I'm having a hard time believing that some of the members are claiming to be Jewish if they seem want to alienate or blaming fellow Jews or even members of the Gay community which is rather sad.
Aaron, Ottawa ON
04/06/10 8:49 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
PRIDE CELEBRATIONS is the Main Topic Here
As a Gay man I would feel safer living in Israel than in Palestine. -- That is not a result of Israel preventing Palestine from becoming an industrialized, developed, free country. Arab or Moslem countries which are prosperous, are currently beating and jailing or even executing Gays based on religious convictions, which are enshrined in their Sharia laws !! In Iran they give Gays a choice --to be mutilated by sex change surgery or go to jail. Why don't you protest that ? Palestinians would most likely adopt Sharia law and continue to persecute Gays even if they become free and wealthy. -- *** The main issue here is: DOES ISRAELI POLITICS NEED TO BE SINGLED OUT FROM OTHER INTERNATIONAL POLITICAL CONTROVERSIES AND PROTESTED AT TORONTO PRIDE 2010 ? *** Councillor Rae had a right point out this idea, if others had lost sight of the main focus of PRIDE. It is already too much that the PRIDE Parade has become a mish-mosh of loosely scattered people walking with unimaginative poorly made signs, along with unrelated advertising trucks. We don't need to scatter the focus even more with out-of-context political crap which creates discord.
Stick to the main issue, Toronto ONT
04/07/10 8:02 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
what's the point?
realistically, pride is NOT about promoting your agenda with regards to another state/country's actions. Pride is about coming together as a community and celebrating our sexuality and the fact that we live in a place that ALLOWS us to do so. This is not an event to push an "Israel Apartheid" agenda, nor argue for the "freedom" of Palestine. QuAIA has NO place in Toronto Pride. Israel Apartheid has it's own week. So take your shit and march then. Leave Pride to a celebration about sexuality, liberation and freedom from persecution on the grounds of sexuality.
Meg Fenway, London Ontario
04/20/10 11:48 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
QuAIA is a gay group and belongs
For all those claiming QuAIA is a hate group or uses hate speech please provide some examples other than your assertion that they are so. I have never heard anything from them or seen anything on their website that would in any way indicate they are anything othjer than what they claim to be, a group of queers cocnerned about Israel's treatment of the Palestinians and nothing more. There have always been groups at Pride protesting against abuses in other parts of the world, why should this group not be allowed to do the same just because they're critical of Israeli policy? Also please point out one single anti-semitic thing said by QuAIA as I can't find them. When all the lies and misrepresentations are ignored there is simply no good legitimate reason for banning QuAIA from marching in the parade. I know many insist they shouldn't be allowed but provide no evidence for banning them, name calling is hardly evidence by the way. Whenever I've asked for evidence of QuAIA's wrong doing in other commnet sections no one has ever provided anything at all, yet the same folks like Charles continually call for them to be banned knowing their is no evidence at all to support banning them. Its clear some have decided already that any group critical of Israel is wrong and there's no two ways about it all without actually examining for yourselves what the group actually has to say. Check out QuAIA's web site for yourself if you think they're so evil and come back with some evidence if you can find it.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
04/20/10 2:02 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
GOOD NEWS
funding should have been cut a long time ago. I cant believe there are so many naive infidels. gay pride is no place for hate !
ALSKY, TORONTO ONTARIO
04/20/10 11:09 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
fire the organizers
'palestinians' should never be allowed to be heard since they only preach hatred against jews/Israel and the west. they need to go home to Jordan
bradly, toronto ont
04/21/10 10:12 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
'occupation' is in the minds of those who hate
Palestinians will try anything to get their phony cause across. Now they have infected pride SHAME ON THEM I WILL BE THERE TO SUPPORT THE JEWS AND ALL INFIDELS shoebat .com
arthur, toronto ontario
04/21/10 10:23 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
GAY PRIDE USED TO BE GREAT
until Pride organizers where fooled by arab hate groups. So many naive people brought up with Judeo-christian values. they have no clue how dangerous these palestinian groups are. All funding for gay pride- must be stopped until Palestinians and their naive supporters are banned
benjy, toronto ont
04/21/10 11:47 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
speaking of hatred
Let's look at what the other side has to say here.... "Palestinians should go home to Jordan"... this is the side of the argument who is suppossed to be peace loving? These Palestinians who have been there for thousands of years don't belong in Israel or the occupied territories? Why? Because they are not jewish? Does that not smack anyone of discrimination? Should a palestinian feel save faced with those kinds of statements? If anyone were to make a similar statement about Israelis you would certainly call them a hate group.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/21/10 1:07 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Defamation
To all those people who claim QaIA are hate groups, who call them a hate group... wouldn't it be great if they had the funds and lawyers to sue you for defamation?
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/21/10 1:13 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Proof of hatred and support by TD and Rae
Some of you are either have terrible reading comprehension abilities or you are purposedly lying. Neither the City of Toronto nor TD Bank have said they want nothing to do with Pride. Kyle Rae's comments are troubling to me, but he is behind Pride and I am sure the City of Toronto will grant us permits next year and probably fund us as they did this year. TD Bank has clarified any issues I might have had about the situation to my satisfaction. They are supportive of Pride, they just want information. Both Rae and TD Bank are aware that the video shown to them was highly biased. QaIA has shown the actual crossed out swastika which could be interpreted in many ways, none of which implies violence against jewish people or Israel. It could be a symbol of anti-racism, anti-anti-semitism, etc, etc... what it cannot be is supportive of anti-semitism because it crosses it out. That the lawyer chose the folded version of the t-shirt that looked as if there was no crossing out of the symbol shows what the other side is willing to do to get their way: lie. And, if you know they are lying to you... how can you trust anything that they say? The lack of integrity is baffling in its arrogance. Who lies like that? Was it Rae that called that video a "vanity video" a City bureaucrat said they failed to mentioned how many of the member of QaIA are jewish. Does this sound like an objective, true seeking group of people or a manipulating bunch who lack any morals? Even if the City of Toronto, Rae and the TD Bank wanted nothing to do with Pride, it wouldn't be because they have anything against the message but because frankly, they are being harrassed by Pro-Israel groups. Where were you people about banning queers against the atrocities in Darfur? Queers against poverty? Related to queer issues? no more than QaIA.
zezi, torotno Ontario
04/21/10 1:24 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
GAY PRIDE IS NOT THE PLACE FOR THESE PEOOLE.
I have seen the hatred these palestinians have. sorry- I dont buy their lies. this is supposed to be about acceptance, love, unity----they are anything but !!! and now becuase of them the gay pride may lose funding. There are places to demonstrate- gay pride is not one of them !
ryan, toronto ontario
04/21/10 8:05 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
PALESTINIANS ARE SO DESPERATE
they prey on the innocence of judeo-christians, who are largely naive. I will continue to send letters demanding that all funding to Palestinian hate groups be banned and that includes funding for Gay Pride, and "Palestine House' where they teach hatred against infidels using tax payers money.
brad, toronto ontario
04/22/10 10:36 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Ive got news for Kyle Rae
just as there are self hating homosexuals-there are self hating jews Joining hate groups is how fringe jews deal with their problems---its not difference than other losers who join fringe groups. IF these jews want to help them- they should go to gaza and march for gay pride - SUCH HYPOCRITES THEY ARE- ALL GAYS AND LESBIANS WOULD BE BEHEADED SO FAST. We definately need to Re-claim pride back from the Islamo-fascists
steven, toronto ontario
04/22/10 12:52 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
"palestinians' are the biggest hypocrites
RE: ZEZI With your argument---its ok for 'pals' to spread hate against infidels but its not ok for infidels to speak the truth ? (70% of Jordanians are Palestinian.) P.s. Lawyers are available to all. We live in Canada- not gaza ! Just as we had funding pulled from CAF (Canadaian Arab Federation) we shall have it pulled from "palestine' House for incitment of hatred. For the naive infidels I highly recommend you watch the movie Fitna and Pallywood to see how 'palestinians' will deceive you.
arthur, occupied Toronto ontario
04/22/10 2:24 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
talk about inciting hatred!
A few of the recent comments here do far more to incite hatred than anything QuAIA has ever said or come out with. Such comments only serve to show the lack of validity of the pro-censorship side which attracts some real hate mongers apparently, I'd like to see anyone find comments from QuAIA that even come close to the hatred expressed in the anti-Palestinian comments above. Please keep showing your true colours boys, its good to know what we're up against.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 3:36 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
infidels?
What are you talking about Arthur? Are you by any chance stuck in the middle ages? It would seem so. QaIA does not incite hatred. Don't you worry... they won't be taking our funding... and even if they did, it won't silence QaIA... you are just making the famous... thank you! The universities haven't had their funding cut... you keep on trying... you will see how we react to it. And if you are queer... shame on you for trying to destroy our event.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 3:46 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Rich please keep showing your true colors
This has nothing to do with censorship or Zionist interference this is why people think your a hate group the big ones use the same terms all the time. Also this has nothing to with censorship at all the QuAIA does not like that there is opposition(a lot) or been exposed this is something I really know you people really really hate like a video that did and you still has not answer why a Middle Eastern War has anything to do with gay rights or how supporting Radical Islam has anything to do with gay rights in Canada. They would love to censorship us all or even kill us just because who we are and that has nothing to do with gay rights or Pride. The QuAIA should go to Gaza or the West Bank but some members have given reason why but either way does show the lack of support or Anti Gay Laws that the Palestinians still enforce or does it seem any of you teabags even know what Apartheid really is another member Zezi didn't like the English definition of it(http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/apartheid). This has nothing to do with censorship but the QuAIA and many of its members seem to be the ones who want to have censorship on this issue Rich the idea have any Jewish/Israeli Groups in Pride you don't seem to like either but they were rather civil or didn't call for the violent overthrow of any country I was there and they were on Gay themes not trying to spread hate or using the Gay Rights Card to cover something either
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/22/10 5:02 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
gladly!
Charles I'll gladly keep showing my true colours because I'm quite proud of them, btw I see you never did come up with any evidence that QuAIA was a hate group or used hate speech like I challenged you to in this thread http://www.xtra.ca/public/Toronto/Public_pressure_from_Pride_sponsorship_nothing_new_TD_Bank-8498.aspx you also never quoted the part of the letter that made the threat you alleged it did. Why not? If you're so convinced that QuAIA is a hate group it should be easy to find evidence of it, name calling doesn't count as evidence btw. How can you claim that trying to ban QuAIA isn't about censorship, do you even know what censorship means? Sure they can say their piece to others but the fact folks are trying to ban their message in their own community during the time of year when such groups traditionally voice their messages, namely the Pride march, is censorship, or at least attempted censorship, it hasn't happened yet of course. Its not a war, its an occupation for one thing and QuAIA is as opposed to radical Islam as it is to Israeli apartheid, check out their website sometime. Members of QuAIA do go to Gaza and the West Bank, one of their members who was on TV the other night mentioned that she had just got back from over there but they are a Toronto based protest group hence the base their protest out of Toronto, what's so wrong with that? Also the word apartheid is regularly used by many Israelis themselves and not just those opposed to their policies towards the Palestinians. Several South Africans who lived through apartheid there toured Israel/Palestine and they felt it was far worse than what they went through, here's the link http://ijvcanada.org/israel/israel-and-apartheid-is-it-a-fair-comparison/ QuAIA has never complained about nor tried to get any other marchers banned, in my opinion if one side of the issue gets banned then both should. QuAIA never called for violence against Israel, if you have evidence they did then show it.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 7:26 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
lets see the proof
If anyone can prove that QuAIA is a hate group I will gladly switch sides to argue for them being banned, I certainly don't support any hate groups marching during Pride. However I've looked for evidence of them being a hate group and found the exact opposite, they are a group of queers committed to trying to make the world a better place, many of them have some sort of connection to Israel/Palestine hence their involvement in the group but you don't need a direct connection to be opposed to the situation over there. Like I said if anyone can find that I missed that QuAIA is hate group then post it and will gladly join the attempts to get them banned.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 7:31 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@ Rich
How does this have anything to do with Gay Rights in Canada? It doesn't Rich and Palestinian Law not Israel is to blame for any suffering of Gay Palestinians it rather clear in Criminal Code Ordinance of 1936 Section 152 of their criminal code of the Palestinian Authority which is still enforce. You can't hide behind self hating Jews either and radical Islam uses Apartheid in the West as a Propaganda tool Rich it not a big secret that Radical Leftest and radical Islam see eye to eye this is rather documented any 20th century history books and Hamas which somehow you think is Gay friendly do spend a lot of money in the West on Propaganda if not that $1000 a night hotel rooms in Dubai or even a so called Queer Group which sound a lot like Hamas or even the KKK at times and
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/22/10 7:42 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
If people who work as teachers
can be in Pride. People who belong to a political organization can be at Pride. That is how Charles... and since you still cannot find proof that QaIA is a hate group... why don't you just let it be? Israel is a recognize nation ... all "liberal democracies" and those who are not, must accept criticism for their actions...
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 8:23 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@zezi,
Well have you even seen a Israeli made movie such as Waltz with Bashir, or Ajami the Bubble, or even Lebanon that was at TIFF 09 all were rather critical of Israeli polices all made by Israelis but as I remember most of the Anti Israel crowd thought it was Israeli Propaganda and I think just those movies that did get funding by the Israeli Government to make them something called the Israel Film Fund and even had the same Anti Israel people had propaganda campaign but failed since no one could understand why were you protesting movies critical of Israeli Polices and still got funding from the Israeli government or zezi was it Palestinians Law or the English Definition of Apartheid that does not suit your political interests which any way still has nothing to do with Gay Rights
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/22/10 8:45 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
not even close
Charles where is the proof that QuAIA is a hate group? Its ridiculous that you consider Jews wanting Israel to be a just society to be self hating, or is that just because they don't agree with your point of view? Btw there is no similarity between the left wing in Canada and radical Islam by which I assume you mean the Islamo-fascists, they are extreme right wingers, that's what fascist means, they have more in common with other religious fundamentalists who want to dictate how people can live their lives than they do with the left wing and the liberation movement. Left wingers tend to be supportive of Muslims in Canada since extremely few of them are extremists and the vast majority are just regular folks just like everyone else yet they face a lot of discrimination and hatred for who they are, I hear far more anti-Muslim/anti-Arab remarks than I do about any other group with the exception of LGBT folks. Left wingers do tend to be supportive of any minority group in need of protection in Canada, that is true, but trying to connect the left wing in Canada to the extreme right wing Islamists is just ridiculous. You claim such a connection is in any history book, please provide an example and a link, I don't recall seeing anything quite so ridiculous in any history book I've ever read. Charles just because you want something to be true doesn't make it so, I understand you have strong beliefs but face it they aren't based on facts or reality. You can believe whatever you want but if you want to convince people your beliefs are correct you need to provide some proof or at the very least use logic in supporting your beliefs.
Rich, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 8:51 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Rich really
The IRA for example does have a long history in cooperation which Radical Islam in the book While Europe Slept by Bruce Bawer or read any 20th century history books I really doubt you ever read one since you claim that one you never read it does document this rather well rather well so it does with Hamas rther intersting about the IRA(radical left) Hamas(far right)hmmmm(http://www.meforum.org/896/hamas-and-the-ira) for example and Rich several members of the QuAIA on the Xtra forum have blame Jews or even Jewish Groups out right for most of their problems or think that there is a Zionist interference or lobby something or another which is rather close to the KKK usually says the same and Rich most people who are members of Hate groups don't even think that they are hating a group of people would denied they are a hate group the KKK uses the same card and the QuAIA is rather close to a hate group so close the QuAIA did break Canadian anti discrimination laws that kind of gives it away.
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/22/10 9:16 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Criticism
Israel cannot expect that criticism comes only wrapped the way it wants. I don't see what your problem is Charles... what do you have against a peace group who seeks equal rights for everyone in Israel and the occupied territories? Does Israel have a different definition of equal rights also? And, you and Gladstone can have all the temper tandrums they want QaIA is here to stay.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 9:31 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
@zezi,
Go see those movies that I suggested or are you going to have another temper tantrum. They were not even close to propaganda and you seem to in denial about a lot even the English definition of Apartheid or even the Oslo Accords, or Palestinian Law and Zezi I really think you are most likely a radical Muslim since Galdstone was only pointing out how the group did break Canadian Law and you must be having a temper tantrum since the QuAIA did call for a violent overthrow of Israel and has nothing to do with with peace or have little to do with Gay Rights in Canada when you called violent overthrow of Israel I think you went over the line when describing your little hate group as a Peace Group or even a Gay Rights group even the KKK uses that line too and even hiding under the rights group card as well the similarities are so close such as breaking Canadian Anti Discrimination laws for example and the left seem to think they are above the Law and that rather applies to everyone and I personally did not see any Jewish or Israeli Groups at Pride calling for the violent overthrow or were they even promoting the occupation as the QuAIA clams but rather Gay Pride in Israel
Charles, Halifax Nova Scotia
04/22/10 10:05 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
I didn't call them propaganda Charles
I just said that Israel cannot pick and chose the kind of criticism it wants. It isn't up to them. Or you. If you are not from here, I mean Toronto, you don't understand the queer community... if QaIA are banned people will find a way to have a protest about it. You can't stop people from wearing t-shirts. What are they going to do about it? Let's agree to disagree... you stay in Halifax and Pride Toronto decides... then our community decides.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/22/10 10:53 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
irony
One general comment I would like to make. I find it ironic that a Gay Pride Parade would allow for this kind of group to march. Israel (as anyone knows who has been there)provides full rights for Gays and has its own world class Gay Pride Parade in fact. Israel is in many ways more accepting of Gay lifestyles than many other countries. (Israel was one of the first nations on earth to officially allow for Gays in its military). In the West Bank and Gaza as well as other parts of the Arab world- all too often people who happen to be Gay are in fear of their lives (never mind the fact that their place in society is not recognized legally. Try walking around as a Gay man or woman in the West Bank and Gaza.... I think indeed there should be a protest at the Gay Pride Parade in Toronto. But it might be directed at some of the governments which surround Israel instead!!!????
dave, montreal Qc
04/23/10 12:11 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
RIGHT SIDE OF THE RAINBOW
pleae watch the movie FITNA to see how muslims will deceive you. as far as i remember, there were always jews marching in the gay parade and then came the 'palestinians' just as they infected University Campuses-they are TRYING to infect gay pride. I WILL CONTINUE MY DEMAND TO CUT FUNDING TO GAY PRIDE AND WHEREVER 'PALESTINIANS' SPREAD THEIR HATE !!!! YES, THERE ARE A LOT OF RIGHT WING GAYS-----WE DONT BUY THE PHONY 'PALESTINIAN' CLAIMS. 'PALESTINIANS' NEED TO MARCH IN GAZA FOR GAY RIGHTS !!!! LOL THE KUFFARS (INFIDELS) WHO MARCH WITH THEM ARE VERY NAIVE SINCE THEY WOULD BE KILLED IN ISLAMIC NATIONS ! ARABSFORISRAEL.COM JIHADWATCH.ORG
HEDA LETTUCE, toronto ontario
04/23/10 11:11 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
APARTHEID ?
How dare palestinians talk about Apartheid. It cheapens what we blacks all went through in South Africa. I understand "Israel Apartheid Week' has been condemned in the Ontario Legislature. I hope Gay pride committee sees through this group and bans them ""ā€œWhat we need to build peace ā€¦ are not inflammatory words like ā€˜apartheid,ā€™ particularly used inappropriately in the case of Israel,ā€ said DiNovo, who was among the 30 MPPs in the 107-seat Legislature for the vote.""
jerome, toronto ontario
04/23/10 1:52 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
about hate and head lettuce
Heda Lettuce, I think it is fantastic that you come in here to show us what a rabid hateful people can label a whole people as liars... not hamas, no the israeli government, but palestinians, all of them. Not the settlers who will drive the palestinians out, no, those are peace loving people who go fully armed to live in a place that doesn't belong to them. No... no... Israel loves the palestinians when it send missiles for three weeks.... killing 1,400 people... loving country, isn't it? All my sources are from Israel or video footage of settlers who don't think much of wanting to drive the palestinians out. I rarely ever get palestinian information, do you?
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/23/10 2:32 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Apartheid meaning
Jerome, The best argument I can accept about Apartheid not being the same as in South Africa is that I am not sure that the South African government sent missiles to black neighbourhoods killing hundreds and hundreds of people. That would make it worst, wouldn't it? At least on that sense. What did you think that protesters here knew about apartheid? Do you think they knew the exact details of your suffering? Which by the way you have no right to compare as more or less than in palestine. They simply knew that the whites did not want to give blacks equal rights, that they wanted to be separate.... this is what apartheid meant to the vast majority of people who boycotted South Africa on behalf of black people. If you have another meaning, good for you, but this was always the general meaning that North Americans had of apartheid. Homophobia is different in all parts of the world, but in spirit, it is the same... thus we use the same word.
zezi, toronto ontario
04/23/10 2:43 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
gay parade is no place for war
'queers against israeli apartheid' have no place demonstrating during Toronto's gay pride festivities. Gay pride is supposed to be aabout unity, love and acceptance. Please find other avenues to express your views
alejandro, toronto ontario
04/23/10 2:56 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
It is about love Alejandro
QaIA is about love for humanity regardless of religion, race, etc. QaIA is following in a long tradition at Pride that perhaps you have missed because you were too busy looking up at the naked men dancing on floats. This type of group has always been part of my Pride. What you are saying is that the palestinian gay groups who oppose their own oppression at the hands of Israel shouldn't matter to us because they are not being endangered and terrorized by Israel because they are gay, just because they are palestinian.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/23/10 3:04 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
zezi,,,,, its about 'love' LOL
before your brothers launched Jihad against Israel and the west. You are funny, calling them (Qaia)love, peaceful Didnt sound like love and peace last year. So when will you have your gay march in Gaza....I want to support the gay palestinians
Alejandro, toronto ontario
04/23/10 3:10 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
poor alejandro
Unless you are prepared to spend some time learning some history sweetie... perhaps you should stay out of the argument. A misinformed opinion in a subject that is so delicate is truly dangerous. You should be a bit more responsible... If Israel wants peace, all it has to do is return to its borders and stop interfering in the life of palestinians. Recently, sweetie, the Israeli government feared that a peace might be imposed on them by the US. They all went on and on about how they were not willing to accept such peace. Peace-loving? I think not. Pride is my forum too and theirs. QaIA is a human rights group and you are just not the sharpest pencil in the box.
Alejandro, Toronto Ontario
04/23/10 3:19 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
poor alejandro (edited)
poor alejandro Unless you are prepared to spend some time learning some history sweetie... perhaps you should stay out of the argument. A misinformed opinion in a subject that is so delicate is truly dangerous. You should be a bit more responsible... If Israel wants peace, all it has to do is return to its borders and stop interfering in the life of palestinians. Recently, sweetie, the Israeli government feared that a peace might be imposed on them by the US. They all went on and on about how they were not willing to accept such peace. Peace-loving? I think not. Pride is my forum too and theirs. QaIA is a human rights group and you are just not the sharpest pencil in the box. The previous name was a mistake. And, I am done talking to a LOL type of brain. You are the type who doesn't need an opposition, everyone knows how much mental process went into what you say by just reading your punctuation marks... if this had smilies, you probably use them too.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/23/10 3:23 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
to" sweetie"
LOL you are funny. Its the 'palestinians' who came to kill the jews in 1948. Jihad is a bitch when your too stupid to do it right !! Israel has every right to defend her borders-AND THAT SHE DOES VERY WELL ! now go back and watch Al Jizeera. Islamofascism in all its forms will be banned just as it was condemned in the Ontario Legislature. Koran - Verse 9:5 'kill the infidels wherever you find them'
alejandro, toronto ontario
04/24/10 10:29 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Alejandro
I get my news from Israeli and Jewish sources. Do you read Israeli newspapers or did your friend just told you so and now you think you are smart? I'll explain this to you slowly so you can understand. If you get your information from people who are fanatical and have something to gain from it, there is a large chance that they are lying to you. If you get your information from members of a community that have nothing to gain from taking a moral stand about what is happenning it is usually because they have high morals. When I read you, I hear the simplest most stupid things that the Pro-Israel group says over and over again, de-contextualized. Only someone who doesn't think much would then say something without having taking on the time to actually look for neutral sources, opposing opions, and know the entire story. I'll help you out, just watch. Then we can talk about hateful.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/24/10 10:41 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
A few links about the situation in Israel for Ale
Here are some links about the situation in Israel Alejandro, it doesn't take a long time and it doesn't take genius. As a disclaimer though, this isn't suppossed to represent all of Israeli society as many of this information arrives to us thanks to progressive, non racist Israelis who are against the occupation and the mistreatment of palestinians. It is also not meant to imply that they are the only ones who act violently as one can find many palestinians who throw rocks too, but while these people are allowed to do it while the IDF looks on, the IDF tends to shoot palestinians who do it. From a jewish human rights group http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5SJs4DPj4U From a jewish human rights group http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLkrDvZX_Y8&feature=related In their own words http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGrAj5tf3xs B'Tselem is Israeli. From Haaretz, an Israeli newspaper About settlers vandalizing palestinian property because they are not allowed to expand their settlements, at least for now... and not that they are listening. http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1163617.html and http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1101831.html Racism towards non-jewish people is rampant in Israel. http://fr.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull&cid=1259231077244 Again, from a Jewish source. I could go on about Israeli Arabs not getting permits to construct their houses, the funding they get from the Israeli government in relation to their population, entire non-jewish villages not recognized by the state. @hat did the Bedouin did to jews again Alejandro? I want Israel to move back to its borders and start treating people within Israel as equal... then it can call itself a progressive liberal democracy... until then, it isn't no matter how well Israeli gays have it, in paper. I have spared everyone the images of the Gaza war.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/24/10 11:17 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
disruptive, questionable
A Gay Pride Parade is not a place to vent your hatred for a group or a nation. In addition to this; the protest against Israel I believe has ulterior and questionable values bordering on racist. With this much controversy - it should behoove the organizers of the Parade to make the right judgment and keep the Parade positive - rather then allowing for this much negativity and controversy to surround it.
dave, Montreal Qc
04/25/10 11:19 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
GOD BLESS ISRAEL
GET YOUR FREE COPIES OF FITNA AT GAY PRIDE. YOU WILL SEE HOW 'PALESTINIANS' WILL DECEIVE YOU. YES TO FITNA AND YES TO GEERT WILDERS SHOEBAT.COM
PROUD KUFFAR, TORONTO ONTARIO
04/25/10 11:40 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Not hatred
Dave, There is no hatred. I didn't hate white South Africans either. There is a difference between hating an entire people and wanting the actions of some people that lead to stealing land, discrimination, massacre, etc. to stop. What you are saying is tantamous of saying one hates people who discriminate... I don't particularly like them... but let's start with who is hateful. Discrimination, stealing land, demolishing homes, sending missiles to civilian areas is proof enough that there are enough people in Israel who think very little of palestinian lives. Nothing was achieved in Gaza... the palestinians asked for ceasefires but Israel didn't want one... it didn't matter how many children it killed. This isn't to say there isn't humanity in Israel... there is... and many people looking for peace, but the actions of the government and the settlers are deplorable and around the world, people, including queer people, want them to stop. Do you know what is hateful, having a list of self-hating jews because they disagree with Israel's policies... a list that says things like "Yes, the thing to the left is actually a woman!" who calls Jason Alexander a self-hating jew for being part of such a beautiful organization as One Voice http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNihPaRloAU which is seeking to end the conflict. That is hateful, seeking an end to the occupation and discrimination is not.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/25/10 4:32 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
SURA 9:5
"KILL THEN INFIDELS WHEREVER YOU FIND THEM" iSLAM MEANS SUBMISSION AND MUSLIMS BELIEVE IN THE SUPREMACY OF iSLAM. NO BURKAS FOR ME- THANKS I will be there to support Israel
right side of the rainbow, toronto ontario
04/25/10 5:57 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
zezi-----you seem to forget many things
1)palestinians did not accept the UN partition plan in 1947 that would have give palestinians a state beside a jewish state. 2) palestinians didnt accept Baraks peace plan in 2000 even though it was the best deal for everyone. Prince Bandar of Saudia Arabia sais----it was a crime by Arafat to let it go. 3) you might want to tell the infidels about Hamas' Charter calling for the destruction of Israel. Is it possible that when you talk about occupation-you are really talking about Israel ? Isnt all of Israel occupied ? TAQQIYAH- DISTORTING THE TRUTH FOR THE SAKE OF ADVANCING ISLAM. You are good at it ! your people should have thought about consequences when you wage jihad and loose.
right side of the rainbow, toronto ontario
04/25/10 6:08 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
zezi- enough already
to show Toronto how welcoming and peaceful Quiai is truly astounding. Please stop insulting our intelligence. there are places for you and your people to demonstrate against Israel- gay pride is not one of them. I hope this will backfire on you when the funding for gay pride is pulled. You have pissed off a great many people who have been involved with gay pride for many years- never a problem until Palestinians starting to push their agenda.
anita hyman, toronto ontario
04/26/10 8:21 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
quoting religious texts
Right side of the rainbow, the old testament, like any other religious story that was created early on in the development of civilizations, is full of violence against others. Your point is? I am against muslim fanatics, christian fanatics and jewish fanatics, and there is lots of that go around for everyone to point fingers at.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/26/10 9:15 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
insulting people's intelligence
Anita, If QaIA has done anything violent against ANYONE, I suggest those pissed people press charges. As for the Palestinians pushing their agenda, I am only involved because the pro-Israel camp has been pushing its agenda... I don't even know a palestinian... so let me explain, the pro-Israel camp told me that there were no Palestinians, they even went as far as to say that the land was empty and that all these people showed up because jewish people showed up, I was told that all land was purchased from Palestinians, that they all grow up to be terrorists, etc, etc... get my drift... you might be brainwashed... I can see through the bs. So, I guess it backfired on you. As far as you hoping our funding gets cut, I doubt you'll manage it, and when you do, if you do, our supporters will increase 10 fold because to everyone this seems as an influential fringe group trying to influence free speech. And, if you are queer, and I wonder if you are because you didn't say you hoped "our funding" gets cut, you should be ashamed of yourself. Violence Anita, is the settlements, where people show up with guns to take over palestinian land.. that... for your information... IS violence.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/26/10 9:28 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
zezi its 2010 not WW2
our threat is from radical muslim- not radical jews or radical christians. Get with the program. So tell me- what would Hamas do with gay pride in gaza ? Would they: 1) hang you 2) shoot you 3) throw you off tall buildings or maybe all 3 palestinians are far from peaceful. Your attempt to show Quia as peaceful loving group is quite funny
right side of the rainbow, toronto ontario
04/26/10 9:36 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
yes zizi I am lesbian and jewish
I have also been to Israel. Have you ? OR do you just like to be brainwashed most intellegent people seek out information for themselves and then form an opinion. I have done my research- have you ? Sorry- we dont preach hatred against Palestinians....I love them as my own. I do have a problem with Quia. I can assure you- none of them have been to Israel and are just brainwahed-poor souls
anita hyman, toronto ontario
04/26/10 10:19 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
rainbow
Let me be clear, and say it slowly, so you know... when Israel stops killing palestinians and stealing their land, I will then concentrate on Hamas. You can see how difficult it is to fight for the rights of homosexuals when everyone is being oppressed.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/26/10 10:55 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Methodology
Anita, First, I commend you for thinking you care for palestinians as your own. At least it shows some good will on your part. As far as research, I think yours is a bit biased. Have you been to Gaza also? have you experienced the settlers? If the tables were turned and all people in Gaza were Jewish people who had been displaced by Muslim immigrants, would you have the same type of trouble calling it apartheid? I wouldn't, because I am neutral to people's religions, are you? Speaking of SA, I don't believe that all white SA was raised to hate black people either, the situation is always complicated. Look, some South Africans were raised by black people. You love palestinians as your own? Really, would you support a one state solution where everyone had equal rights? I already gave up on the idea because of all the hatred of religious extremists in both sides. I want peace for both Israel and Palestine, and my own, unbiased research, from someone who has lived through terrorism herself, and who only knows people who know people from QaIA, is that Israel isn't trying hard enough to get to peace. If anything, it is the pro-Israel group who tried to brainwash me... and I felt this way way before there was a Queers Against Israeli Apartheid. I made sure my sources were corraborated by many groups, neutral groups were good, groups that belonged to one or another nationality who agreed with the interests of their own were bad sources, and those who stood out against the policies of their own governments were pretty reliable sources because they have nothing to gain from it and were doing it despite the fact that they are or could be ostracized by their community. You should never trust someone who has something to gain from what they are saying. What did you do again for research? What was your methodology? By the way, my research showed that the Pro-Israel group tended to lie all time.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/26/10 11:15 AM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
zezi- re rainblow
"" when Israel stops killing palestinians and stealing their land, I will then concentrate on Hamas. "" 1) Israel does not kill palestinians. It is Hamas who kills Palestinians due to their constant rocket attacks into Israel (over 8000) Israel had every right to respond. Every nation would have done the same. 2) Israel doesnt steal land. I have a better idea for you. Since Hamas has ethnically cleansed jews from gaza-how will the jews be compensated or do you feel palestinians should receive special rights ? So- as I have read here and elsewhere- what does this conflict have to do with Toronto's gay pride ? I can assure you this will backfire on you. We will have funding cut for Pride just as we had funding cut at Canadian Arab Federation for incitement.---its only a matter of time.
anita hyman, toronto ontario
04/26/10 12:41 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
FITNA, SHOEBAT.COM JIHADWATCH.ORG
I would suggest that people watch these videos to see how radical muslims use freedom of speech to spread their hatred. dont let them infect the gay community under the victim role. They are far from victims. Hitler started with less support.
right side of the rainbow, toronto ontario
04/26/10 2:11 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
Israel Kills Palestinians
Anita, The missiles come from Israel. The problem with Israel is that it never takes responsibility for anything it does. It is always the fault of the Palestinians isnĀ“t? Israel is always the victim here? Do you even know how ridiculous and one sided that sounds? As far as ethnically cleansing Gaza, I thought that was that IDF that took them out? Do you want video? I am sure I can find you some so you can see those peaceful settlers who never stole the land? If those settlers had wanted to live democractically with palestinians in one state, maybe they should have stayed... but that is not an option isn't it? And it isn't because they believe all palestinian land is theirs, but because those palestinians, for no reason, hate them.. right? They are lunatics those palestinians you think of as your own. As far as Israel not stealing land.. for your education: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGrAj5tf3xs then they settle.. and somehow become legal? Israel doesn't take responsibility...because Israel never takes responsibility for anything it does. As far as not teaching children to hate palestinians or muslims. It really is sad, but you should be aware of the truth: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH0o_07BBk0&feature=related And I can find more.. I could fill the entire thing with links so people can see for themselves what is going on. As for it is just a matter of time... remember, you were unable to take money away from the universities and they all still have Israel Apartheid Weeks. The thing is who do you think you are to threaten to cut funding for Pride? Do that... it will hit the newspapers... the television stations... and Pride will go on. What is sad is that somehow, against all logic, you think you are doing the right thing and if we are lucky enough to see an end to this, one day you will realize how wrong you were, I hope. Still... Pride will go on.
zezi, Toronto Ontario
04/26/10 2:42 PM EST
Report this comment to moderator.
TAQQIYAH ANYONE ?
TAQQYIAH = destorting the truth for the sake of advancing Islam... Here you have a classic example how 'palestinians' and their naive supporters want to show you how peacefull they are while we have many videos of the hatred that comes out of their mouths Its ok....its all been presented to appropriate people. as someone else said---its only a matter of time before Pride funding is cut.....and we will all thank 'Palestinian'. Seems like they are hated everywhere they go. I guess thats what a phony 'resistance' movement does to them
right side of the rainbow, toronto ontario
04/27/10 8:46 AM EST
Report this comment to mod